capo
I prefer Druid tanking over both. :D
So the way Reckoning works on Classic, do you think it is still useful for Paladin off-tanks and dungeon tanks? Talking strictly PvE here, not PvP. I'm also not interested in using start/stop attack macros.
What do you think about Anticipation and Deflection? Based on the other talents, as a Prot Paladin you WANT to get hit and crit right, so why would you ever take these two talents?
Absolutely. For dungeons its an amazing tool if you keep your defense relatively low so you get consistently crit. Its going to hasten your attacks and provide you with larger returns on your mana regeneration.
For raids it really depends on your role. If you are primarily tanking something where you can use Greater Kings to hold aggro then you want as much defense as possible, and Anticipation is pretty ok for that since you afford the points when you dont have Reckoning.
I dont use Anticipation for raids myself and instead just go with Reckoning so its more comfy to do 5man and solo. Dont feel like the extra defense has been necessary as Im never really in danger of dying in the current content with just 380.
Oh, and I have to go brag a little bit to end my post. Today was a very lucky raid day :-)
In b4 someone tells you that Thunderfury is akkhsually terrible for pally tanking and you should use XYZ insted.
In b4 someone tells you that Thunderfury is akkhsually terrible for pally tanking and you should use XYZ insted.
Nah, tfury is really high up there for threat weapons.
BIS wep for us. SoR doubles the proc rate.
Absolutely. For dungeons its an amazing tool if you keep your defense relatively low so you get consistently crit. Its going to hasten your attacks and provide you with larger returns on your mana regeneration.
For raids it really depends on your role. If you are primarily tanking something where you can use Greater Kings to hold aggro then you want as much defense as possible, and Anticipation is pretty ok for that since you afford the points when you dont have Reckoning.
I dont use Anticipation for raids myself and instead just go with Reckoning so its more comfy to do 5man and solo. Dont feel like the extra defense has been necessary as Im never really in danger of dying in the current content with just 380.
Can you elaborate as for why Reckoning is so good? The way it works is that it just resets your swing timer and let's you potentially hit faster right? How often do you actually get crit by mobs in dungeons and in raids as a 4th support tank?
What do you think about the Deflection talent? Good or not? My logic would be not to take it, as I want to get hit and not parry a lot?
Man this thread sure has been derailed with all these legitimate questions and information about paladins. I thought this was supposed to be a neverending battle of wills between different personalities on the forum.
Absolutely. For dungeons its an amazing tool if you keep your defense relatively low so you get consistently crit. Its going to hasten your attacks and provide you with larger returns on your mana regeneration.
For raids it really depends on your role. If you are primarily tanking something where you can use Greater Kings to hold aggro then you want as much defense as possible, and Anticipation is pretty ok for that since you afford the points when you dont have Reckoning.
I dont use Anticipation for raids myself and instead just go with Reckoning so its more comfy to do 5man and solo. Dont feel like the extra defense has been necessary as Im never really in danger of dying in the current content with just 380.
Can you elaborate as for why Reckoning is so good? The way it works is that it just resets your swing timer and let's you potentially hit faster right? How often do you actually get crit by mobs in dungeons and in raids as a 4th support tank?
What do you think about the Deflection talent? Good or not? My logic would be not to take it, as I want to get hit and not parry a lot?
Sure. I think reckoning is good for 5man dungeons because I dont really use a lot of defense. When I tank dungeons I only pick about 30-40 defense to get some avoidance and to even out the worst of the spikes from crit. Instead I favor stacking stamina, and I focus on keeping up a high armor by using T1/T2 items when I have those available, or just 2 set Valor + Lightforge and some of the high armor plate items if I dont have access to tier sets.
Mobs in Classic dungeons do not really do a lot of damage. So I realized early you could pull two packs at a time in most of the dungeons, and in lower level dungeons like BRD you can even pull 3-4 packs at a time. This will greatly increase the frequency of which you get crit, and in turn lead to more reckoning procs.
I dont like using the word "reset your swingtimer", because thats not really whats happening. A swingtimer reset would be something like if you played a Warrior, had a 4 second attackspeed with two second remaining on the timer, then used your ability Slam, then your next auto attack would "reset" and occur in the next 4 seconds.
Instead with Reckoning, as long as you have autoattack active, getting crit with hasten your attack and make your next attack occur instantly. Its not a reset. With how reckoning worked on private servers where it stored attacks until next time you swung, it would actually be possible to cap charges if you pulled enough mobs, meaning any additional crits beyind the first 4 before your next swing would be wasted and not lead to reckoning procs.
With Classic reckoning, if you are tanking a MASSIVE amount of mobs, say 4 packs in BRD you may end up attacking really really fast instead which leads to you restoring a huge amount of mana if you happen to have Judgement of Wisdom up on the target, or Seal of Wisdom active.
In a raid I dont think Reckoning is very good. Could be nice in Suppression Room in BWL if your guild keeps a high pace and you dont get a lot of time to drink. For bosses it barely does anything as you want to have a high amount of defense for those.
As for Deflection. Parry is not just defensive, but its also offensive as it hastens your swingtimer by 40% of the remaining time of the swing (simple explanation)
Parry also never replace a Block which is your main source of reflective threat so by parrying the attack you really only lose out on the return damage you would have gotten from Retribution Aura. It's not a huge loss when it means you get a hastened attack leading to more TPS from Seal of Righteousness and more mana restored from Judgement of Wisdom.
Thanks man, such a great answer! Is Deflection a talent that you view as an absolute must or is it more of a nice to have option to increase your survivability?
It's not a must but 4% additional Parry (Cant get the talents to get 5% if you want both Consecration and Holy Shield) is pretty strong to add on top of your other avoidance from gear.
Another update. Today we tried to switch to the other Garr strategy in order to save some time. Previous weeks we have cleared everything before going back to Garr in order to not lose world buffs, but I was fairly confident we could do Garr with just offtanking the adds and killing the boss first.
Went very well. I was a bit concerned with how much damage I would take. But since we dont have a Warrior tank with Force Reactive disk yet, I gave it a shot. Requested lay on hands before the pull and used armor potions. Worked like a charm, and we got the boss down easily.
Is this one single paladin on all of the adds?
Would it be possible with a blue shield?
How is mana per five for tanking?
What stats should you go for and what should you avoid?
@Holyfrog: Have you successfully tanked Dire Maul and LBRS/UBRS pre-60?