I've only played since BC/WoTLK so I'm not really sure on this.
I've been watching a few videos on picking a race/class (atm, for me its shaman or priest), and a lot seem to praise specific races with a certain class. For example, it seems a Dwarf Priest is incredible due to its fear ward.
If I want to get into some end-game raiding/progression runs, and if I wanted to do an Ally Priest, will I get turned away from some guilds if I'm not a dwarf? Alternatively, if I want to roll a Shaman, it seems anything BUT an Orc is a no-no?
I’ve rolled sub optimal race class combinations and in my experience it will not hurt you for raiding. There will be some guilds that want you to be the most optimal race class spec combination. But the rest of the guilds will take any race class spec combination with open arms if they show up and are a joy to play with.
I wouldn’t be having fun staring at a male troll’s posture the entire leveling process.
Please keep in mind that although PvE really shouldn't be a problem for playing what you want, other players who happen to be playing say, Human Warrior or Rogue (which just happen to be PvE best) may give you flack for not being your PvE best, even if you're playing a Human just like them and they wouldn't play Gnome Warrior even if it was PvE best.
Sometimes people will avoid playing a class just because they're already used to playing one where "Best" and "Aesthetics" are perfectly aligned and switching classes would mean they weren't. Strange, but I know some.
So be ready to fend off suggestions and comments that you should "be a Dwarf" or "why aren't you X?".
Please keep in mind that although PvE really shouldn't be a problem for playing what you want, other players who happen to be playing say, Human Warrior or Rogue (which just happen to be PvE best) may give you flack for not being your PvE best, even if you're playing a Human just like them and they wouldn't play Gnome Warrior even if it was PvE best.
Sometimes people will avoid playing a class just because they're already used to playing one where "Best" and "Aesthetics" are perfectly aligned and switching classes would mean they weren't. Strange, but I know some.
So be ready to fend off suggestions and comments that you should "be a Dwarf" or "why aren't you X?".
I think that's a really good point to make. I suppose, much like what a lot of the suggestions above are hinting at, the proof comes from the player's "skill" as opposed to what their race/class is.
I think all that stuff is stupid, you should pick what you want to play.
When vanilla was current when I selected my class/race I was not thinking about min/max -ing or what will be best at end game. Hell, i didnt even know what dungeons and raids were when creating my character. I selected a priest because i wanted to heal and help people and dwarf because i didnt want to be human. I guess i got lucky with a real good class/race combo but hey our best priest in our guild was a night elf and by alliance standards isnt that the worst race for priest for PVE...?
Either way our guild cleared all raids except naxx and our first C'Thun kill, I was a shadow priest.
I mean a raid with 40 people in it during current we had a few afks and a few no trys all the time.
You really only needed like 25-30 people working and trying hard to clear MC, BWL and maybe AQ40.
I also remember us bringing under geared alts or level 58s for tryouts as well.
Didn't stop us from clearing MC and BWL in one night.
All you need is the appropriate enough tanks, heals and dps to clear the raids.
Spec and Race, I dont think matters unless you are going for world first which will be what 1%-3% of the population in wow classic maybe?
I think skill (knowing how to play your class/spec/race) aka the player and gear is more important...
Sorry side note: we had this paladin who was full T2 and would go afk all the time (he was really young but good and got in trouble with his parents all the time) and one time he made a mistake and auto followed our Rogue in the suppression room LOL and you see this paladin run in like lerooy. Paladins are not sneaky!
Spec and Race, I dont think matters unless you are going for world first which will be what 1%-3% of the population in wow classic maybe?
I think skill (knowing how to play your class/spec/race) aka the player and gear is more important...
I don't think that race choice is imperative, but it is a small factor. When we start going into the territory where we say 'Spec's dont matter', I think we've surpassed the threshold of what is reasonable. If your guild plans to roll with 4 resto druids, a druid main tank, 3 boomkins, and a shaman offtank, we've surpassed the point in which the guilds performance will be adequate enough to down content. Back to your point, Spec and race do MATTER, they just aren't imperative as OP was originally asking. 40 people is a lot, and there is a lot of wiggle room for poor race choice, but spec choice has a far greater impact on the throughput of your character than your race. I think that every guild can have a handful of terrible specs (suboptimal specs/meme specs), but its not realistic to say that specs don't matter, they do to a certain extent.
As with everything people seem to have an all or nothing attitude. Absolutism. Either everything must be min/maxxed to the Nth degree or none of these factors matter and you should choose your race/spec combo for entirely self interested purposes and still expect and invite to any and all content in which you wish to participate because the RPG elements of the game outweigh player performance entirely. The truth lies somewhere in between and the reality of your choices and what you place value on will change for each individual player and those they interact with.
... 4 resto druids, a druid main tank, 3 boomkins, and a shaman offtank...
I accept your challenge...
As for the Orc question, well...
Thrall is a shaman, therefore every shaman must be an orc.
Screw you, all my shamans are Draenei!
Unless you're playing for a guild going for world first I really don't think it's going to matter.
Another thing worth pointing out...raids are FORTY people. Thats a lot of slots to fill and having a player is always better than having an open slot. Unless your in a "full clear MC in 1 hour" super try-hard guild, pretty much _anyone_ can raid if they show up on time and can at least play their class/spec
Ill put it this way...(these numbers are arbitrary, im just trying to make a point)
If you are lvl 60 and logged in, you already have a 30% chance to get into a raid. (Depending on the raid and your class, you might not even have to be 60! Everyone wants free pally buffs!)
-Add to that, "i know how to play my class/spec reasonably well", your chances just went up to 40%
-add to that, "everyone knows im chill and i get along well with my guildmates". 60%.
-add on top of that, "i have at least most of my pre-raid BiS gear", now youre taking 80%.
-add to that, "ive min-maxed my race/class/talents/items/gear/enchants to be as good as possible"....needless to say, thats going to get you right up to 100%. Hell, if youre THAT dedicated, you'll want to find a new, more hardcore guild anyway.
THIS
Additionally, if you're a prot warrior, you have a 100% chance of getting into raids and getting first dibs on gear even if you have an IQ lower than your CPU temperature, because your guild is eventually going to need 8 well-geared prot warriors for the Horsemen fight and a prot warrior's rotation is only two buttons (sunder armor and... whatever the thing is that buffs the party)
It is hard to spot the difference if you pick the race for min-maxing if you are not in a group that is min-maxing everything. If you already are, you wouldn't be asking this question here, anyway. So it is a flavor. It is a character you are gonna play for a few years in advance. Pick the setup (flavor) that you like the most, that you will enjoy playing. Few percentage difference can be managed by smart play, smart gear choices & consumes.
The only difference to the "rule" would be an alliance priest. Dwarf really brings one unique, full and super useful raid ability to the table, it is a loss for the same time invested in building a character. However, even without the ward, you will be accepted as a good healer mostly in any raid anyway, due to the sheer lack of healers if you don't like the look & feel of Dwarfs.
It is hard to spot the difference if you pick the race for min-maxing if you are not in a group that is min-maxing everything. If you already are, you wouldn't be asking this question here, anyway. So it is a flavor. It is a character you are gonna play for a few years in advance. Pick the setup (flavor) that you like the most, that you will enjoy playing. Few percentage difference can be managed by smart play, smart gear choices & consumes.
The only difference to the "rule" would be an alliance priest. Dwarf really brings one unique, full and super useful raid ability to the table, it is a loss for the same time invested in building a character. However, even without the ward, you will be accepted as a good healer mostly in any raid anyway, due to the sheer lack of healers if you don't like the look & feel of Dwarfs.
I agree with your points but I just feel like I had to mention that it is very funny how everyone is saying that there is lack of healers, which is actually not. There are so many players rolling healers nowadays. :mrgreen:
There is just no way I'd ever play this game worried about rolling a toon the way someone else wants me to roll it. What's the point in letting someone else tell you how and what to play. Stop with the videos they are pointless. Play the game in a couple weeks and figure out what you personally like that makes you happy.
There is just no way I'd ever play this game worried about rolling a toon the way someone else wants me to roll it. What's the point in letting someone else tell you how and what to play. Stop with the videos they are pointless. Play the game in a couple weeks and figure out what you personally like that makes you happy.
This guy is right as well as others have said in this thread!
Play the game to have fun not as a job! (unless you get paid to play the game)
Think of Leeroy, you think he gave a f*ck about min/max-ing?
Naw....Leeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeroy!
I've heard a lot of talk about it and I think the thing that stuck out to me the most is that if you're interested in min maxxing, your racials for PvP will have much more impact than your racials for PvE so it's better to pick for PvP than PvE if you want to be all-rounder.
Regardless aesthetics trump racials imo.