ITT: People talking about pserver times, when all the pservers had dynamic loot/respawns for leveling. This speeds the process up A LOT!
This is part of why I'm so sceptical about this, and noone seems to be addressing it. A similar discussion happened on MMO champion and people tossed out stuff like "Yeah most people will easily be 60 in 48-60 hours so that leaves plenty of time.."
Eh? Fastest vanilla time was that famous 4 days and 20 hours one wasn't it? Think my personal record was a bit under 6 days, and was like with some rested xp and stuff. I'm by no means a proper speed-leveler, but 48 hours? Like, how do you even get to level 50 in that time? Don't think I've even seen level 40 in 48 hours..
But whenever I bring this up people just mysteriously bail the conversation, across like 4 different forums now.
If there is some miraculously fast way to level that nobody knew in vanilla that everyone on private servers now know inside out, then by all means let me stand correct. I'll happily have my face stepped into the dirt, foolishly wrong in my assumptions. But so far I've seen nothing but people dodging the question.
And I mean, if it takes you 5 days played time to get to level 60, on top of at the very least bare minimum sleep and chugging energy bars for sustenance, bringing your laptop to the bathroom to save time (but you still gotta wipe surely!?) etc etc I just cannot see people stepping into MC the first week at all, and that means a brutal amount of pre-lucifron trash farming if you want to be able to do Ragnaros that week.
I remember all too well in my old old old times guild how I was well ahead of the rest at lvl 60 and ended up indeed running trash farming pugs specifically for the rep. When the time came to seriously do MC, and we killed our merry way through, I had baaarely managed the honored rep as the only person in the guild, and so I alone could get the rune dousing quest item. Mind you, that was a one time use, so we needed to establish a chain of summoning to get me from Aszhara to MC, remove a rune, back out, summoned to Aszara for a new one, summoned back again, etc..
Are people just somehow forgetting you need honored with waterlords to be able to start the rune dousing quest, which requires you to kill the first bloody boss in the entire place? I just don't understand what I am missing.
If a group of powerlevers can get ahead and stay ahead of the curve it will help leveling times immensely because there is no competition on mob respawns etc. If you aren't ahead of the curve, it's going to take you 6-10 days played time without fucking around too much. That's my take on it at least.
2Weeks is possible but super super hard because you need also rep to summon majordomo. I think 3Weeks for the first clear is mire realistic
Also, to expand on this. you need 39 OTHER people to be "poopsock" worthy as you. Along with have RNGesus loot drops. A LOT of stars have to align. On top of all of this, pservers might launch even smoother than some retail expansions. Fighting mob tag competition, server crash, server DCs, server queues, all of this it going to really expand the speed run to 60.
With regards to the rep you can farm elementals in silithus to get honoured, then you can do the quests for the trash drops and the hands from the flamewalker bosses during the raid. Generally the fastest way is to tell your fastest leveling mage to start aoe grinding rep in silithus when he's near hitting 60. Then you can set up a summoning rotation so that the one guy can go back and forth from Azshara.
Another big obstacle is having enough fire resist gear on the main tank so he can do Ragnaros, but this is just one guy and if he's a completely nosleep hardcore guy and gets fire resist boes funneled to him this is pretty easy. Everyone else needs GFPP for Rag so someone needs to get the potion recipe from LBRS and farm a few herbs.
A full MC clear will take about as long as it takes a completely hardcore guild with a roster full of people planning on 30 hour + sessions to hit 60 and run a few dungeons to get the absolute minimum gear - I know of at least 2 guilds like this that will be trying to kill a few bosses in MC week 1. This will probably be about 8-10 days after launch.
Also, to expand on this. you need 39 OTHER people to be "poopsock" worthy as you. Along with have RNGesus loot drops. A LOT of stars have to align. On top of all of this, pservers might launch even smoother than some retail expansions. Fighting mob tag competition, server crash, server DCs, server queues, all of this it going to really expand the speed run to 60.
You wont need 40 players to clear MC. You wont even need your entire roster to be 60. In regards to Pserver launches... Competing with 12k active users at any given time is not outweighed by dynamic respawns, ESPECIALLY if you are on a pvp server, which is the only option on private. Trust me, depending on how/if Blizz implements sharding for launch, Classic will be a complete breeze to level in compared to private. I havent looked into the specific implications of no progressive itemization during pre-bis, but that will also be a crutch in Classic that was not available on private as your guild gets drops during your MC clear. Farming consumes and world drops like devilsaur will also be incredibly easy on Classic compared to private where the server had about 30-40k players logging in periodically; peak time is ALL the time on private and this is painful for collecting herbs and resources.
The only thing left are boss values... Many boss values on private are spoofed based on extrapolated data and old combat logs. What does this mean? It means private is either very close to vanilla's values, private is potentially easier than vanilla was OR private may just be a little bit more challenging than vanilla was and Classic will be.
*An important point is also pets. Hunters are very important for speed clears. Hunter dps is nutty with Lupos, and all signs are pointing to Lupos being in his final state without shadow damage. This will hurt hunter dps and depending on raid comps, this could present issues for some guilds.
Overall I could see MC being cleared on the first lockout by guilds like Method who are already recruiting for their roster. Guilds like this have an immense amount of resources at their disposal, all the time in the world for players who live in gaming houses and are full time players and then the advantages of having each of those streamer audiences pooling resources towards their success.The preparation and time investment to an early Classic clear is nothing compared to what these guys are doing in retail. The average hardcore guild will see bosses down within 1-2 weeks and a rag kill within 2-3. On most servers MC will start being pugged by the 6 week mark so if you want to get in fast, spend some time getting up that Waterlord rep because pre-BiS wont necessarily gain you a spot but douses certainly will.
MC shouldn't even be unlocked until 2 months after launch. Let people stop and smell the god damn roses without being punished for it by falling behind in the raiding rat race.
Or, people can play at their own pace and not be dictated by others on how to experience the game?
I would think that Blizzard would have the boss values tuned quite high initially to curb 2 week clears. It's going to be a tough ask with no DM gear as it stands, but if they are also tuned harder it will be very challenging indeed.
I would think that Blizzard would have the boss values tuned quite high initially to curb 2 week clears. It's going to be a tough ask with no DM gear as it stands, but if they are also tuned harder it will be very challenging indeed.
Obviously the content wont be tuned harder at the start of the game.
for everyone here, see https://barrens.chat/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=2105
A lot of this is covered in there. I think week 2 full MC clear is highly likely, I will be surprised if it doesnt happen.
Couple things to remember:
1. Beta numbers show dungeon grinding being really good xp/hour. arguably better than questing.
2. Because dungeon grinding looks so good, leveling and gearing are not mutually exclusive, but instead done simotaniously. most time can be spent in dungeon grind groups 52-60
3. /Played to 60 will likely be lower on classic than on PS's. A number of things in classic appear to easier on classic than PS, such as dungeons granting more xp/kill and mobs being significantly easier to kill in many cases overall.
4. Leveling routes have been min/maxed to an extent far more than orriginal release. Joanna was able to run 4.5 days /played to 60 on orriginal release, these routes were more secretive and harder to get access to back then. Now they are more or less public knowledge, been improved on, and the harder to level PS's have seen people hit < 4 days /played.
5. I cant verify this, but most people say reg grinds and attunement can be done pre-60 while level grinding too. Also, others in the linked thread above have stated this can be done in as little as 2 hours.
6. By the raw numbers, it's possible, but unlikely, to be done in week 1. Def possible in week 2.
The hardest part about this is organizing 40 people and getting them to all commit to this. (although you dont need a full 40)
The real question is, how quickly can you get a Prot warrior up to level 60?
lol right? everyone in the guild start funneling every warrior boe drop you get to your tanks mailboxes.
The real question is, how quickly can you get a Prot warrior up to level 60?
Dungeon cleave teams will likely see warriors hitting 60 in about 3-4.5 days played at the very highest level. Average melee cleaves can see times of 4.5-5.5 days quite easily. Keeping in mind that as long as a level 60 is killing tagged mobs that are 48 or higher, the person who tagged them doesnt suffer any XP loss. So this means that at any point someone in the guild hits 60, they can easily turn around and start killing tags for the warrior for a quick power level assuming the warrior has hit level 48 at this point.
Obviously the content wont be tuned harder at the start of the game.
As happened in every release of the game? Starts out tuned high, and is slowly tuned down to open it up to the masses. No?
In this case though, they do seem to just be doing a copy/paste from their 1.12 client, so it will be easier if anything. 16 debuff slots, all classes fleshed out, talents improved and bosses fixed/tuned. It does appears as if Blizzard stance is more leaning toward an exact recreation of 1.12, rather than 'Preserving an authentic vanilla experience" which it will not feel like. Vanilla was hard when it was new, it will not be hard now.
Yes.. Because artificially buffing Vanilla content past the actual difficulty of 1.12 is even remotely comparable to later expansions nerfing content as the expansion progresses right?
All it would do is to cause a shitstorm of drama when players realize the content suddenly got nerfed. Blizzard is ofcourse not going to do anything like this. It's completely out of the realm of possibility.