As a #nochanges person, my knee-jerk response is no. However, coming from playing Eve Online, which pioneered this idea, I have only seen good things come from introducing this into a game. Most importantly it makes sure that real life cash is directed towards the game creators rather than botters/farmers. Since most of the best gear is bop raid gear/battleground rewards, which can't be directly purchased with gold, this won't make the game much more play2win than it already is. (Yes there will be groups that have instances on farm, running people through for gold, but there will always be gold sellers. Since this will happen anyway, I prefer that cash go to Blizzard). If they can make enough this way to justify keeping the game otherwise as it is, without micro-transactions, then this is a huge win. Of course they will probably get greedy and try for both, but I will take this over micro-transactions any day, even if it does mess with the economy a bit. Free markets have a way of balancing themselves out anyway.
He gets it. I think this is exactly the case. "Knee-jerk responses". That seems to be the theme I'm seeing when reading posts by people who are anti token. A lot of them don't seem to have any idea how it works or what it does. Eve definitely pioneered this idea with great success. In one of the previous interviews I linked with a major gold broker during WotLK, the Eve token is mentioned. I spent a lot of time linking old articles to establish the prevalence of gold buying and selling during this time period. A lot of people misunderstood the effort I put into establishing the size of that market. My aim wasn't to prove that gold farming existed, rather to shed some light on how enormous that market was. The game was always pay to win.
Despite discussions that have taken place, and sources have been providing stating the benefits of tokens vs. the detriment of gold farming/bots, everyone has their opinion on whether they would prefer WoW Token, or whether people are happy to rely on Blizzard anti-bot, anti-gold selling technology to minimise the impact, while obviously accepting it can never be truly stopped. Simple poll to get a consensus of peoples personal opinions.
I have allowed re-voting, as I see this topic creating a lot of discussion and fluctuating opinions.
No. Gold is actually worth something in Classic. I'd like to keep it that way, if possible. I realize gold sellers and bots are going to exist, but that's Blizzard's problem to solve. The token makes sense in retail because A) people are rich beyond imagination and B) Gold isn't very important in retail.
I’m all for it. It does put a huge strain on gold farmers. Doesn’t change my experience one bit.
No. Gold is actually worth something in Classic. I'd like to keep it that way, if possible. I realize gold sellers and bots are going to exist, but that's Blizzard's problem to solve. The token makes sense in retail because A) people are rich beyond imagination and B) Gold isn't very important in retail.
I firstly want to say that I don't want tokens in Classic, however farmers/bots also creates gold which causes inflation. If bots/farmers only farmed materials this wouldn't happen, but they are in fact also farming RAW gold, which creates inflation. So tokens or not, inflation will always happen.
No. Gold is actually worth something in Classic. I'd like to keep it that way, if possible. I realize gold sellers and bots are going to exist, but that's Blizzard's problem to solve. The token makes sense in retail because A) people are rich beyond imagination and B) Gold isn't very important in retail.
Hit it right on the marx!
This stuff existed in vanilla and will in classic, blizzard will handle it by banning in the past most likely
Being able to buy gold "legally" would 100% make me do it, and I would hate myself for doing it in Classic.
I do not want tokens in WoW Classic. While I understand that bots/farmers can still cause inflation, I think buying tokens would have a greater impact on the economy.
No. Gold is actually worth something in Classic. I'd like to keep it that way, if possible. I realize gold sellers and bots are going to exist, but that's Blizzard's problem to solve. The token makes sense in retail because A) people are rich beyond imagination and B) Gold isn't very important in retail.
Gold is worth a lot more when black gold isnt being injected into the market. The token doesnt devalue gold. In fact it does the opposite. It gives gold a baseline monetary value.
I do not want tokens in WoW Classic. While I understand that bots/farmers can still cause inflation, I think buying tokens would have a greater impact on the economy.
Bots and farmers have a greater impact on the economy.
This new thread is pretty irritating given the work other posters had on the previous thread I created a few days ago. By starting a new thread we are essentially restarting this entire conversation. A poll was not worth recreating the thread. A simple yes/no vote is not as valuable as stating your opinion and giving supporting evidence to sell that claim to your peers. The truth is, anyone here can click yes or no, but building a compelling argument for or against the token is a bit more challenging.
"No, I dont like the token because it was anti vanilla. Tokens are bad. I hate token stuff. I voted no! Tokens are bad for the economy! Tokens make the game pay to win! Tokens create gold!" - not valuable, not accurate and not helping the conversation.
Some facts: The game was always pay to win. See previous thread with sources indicating that the gold farming industry was massive. No one here has provided a link to support that the token increases the quantity of gold being traded between players.
All indications of Classic would lead a logical thinker to presume that the demand for gold will INCREASE in Classic.
The base cost of Classic is LESS than retail vanilla was 15 years ago which will mean gold selling will have a lower overhead. Bot detection and anti cheat have improved, but there are still bots actively working in retail meaning that this isn't a perfect solution. Which is why retail DID implement the token. Removing all the bots still doesn't address the gold farming issue. The token destroys both methods of selling gold simultaneously (at a mass commercialized level).
These are all facts. Facts that can be supported by evidence. A yes/no vote does not move the conversation forward without addressing these concerns.
Gold sales existed in retail vanilla. This was a massive market. Gold sales still exist on private servers. This is a massive issue. Gold sales will exist on Classic. The question should be... Do you want the token OR do you want gold sellers/bots? Which serves to hurt the economy more and which will ruin your immersion more? Buying gold will be available either way, and all signs point to this market being as big or bigger than it was in vanilla.
Some more info for those interested. This piece comes from Blizzard directly during the announcement of the token...
"Buying gold from third-party services negatively impacts the game experience for everyone. The overwhelming majority of the gold these services provide comes from stolen player accounts, halting the victims’ ability to play the game and contribute to their guilds. On top of this, gold selling companies often farm resources using hack programs, sell fake product codes as a scam, and spam entire realms with ads to buy gold, disrupting the game in very real ways.
The WoW Token allows players to exchange real money for gold in a secure and sanctioned way—together with the ongoing efforts of our developers, support staff, and anti-hack teams to stop the exploits these companies use and help players who have become victims of their operations, we hope the Token can help make World of Warcraft a safer and more enjoyable game for all of our players." (Blizzard Entertainment)
Blizzard obviously didn't acknowledge that botting and farming got to such a point that their anti-hack software was unable to make a dent in the population of farmers, but based on the sources I linked previously, that was likely the case. The token was the best anti-bot software that Blizzard had ever implemented.
A caveat here is to understand that supply and demand accommodates the gold that is lost during ban waves. The gold sellers don't incur loss when they lose their accounts or a stockpile of gold, they simply raise their prices to match supply and the users purchasing gold incur the loss of the previous accounts being banned.
Source https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/news/18141101/introducing-the-wow-token
A premier gold seller who specialized in selling virtual currencies from the early 90's to the mid 2000's was Markee Dragon. As a mass gold seller in other games, Markee offered an excellent solution to the gold selling crisis plaguing games 3 years before Blizzard announced their token.
Markee says "what if you bought game time, 35$ or whatever it is for a 60 day code, and you gave it to a friend in exchange for gold?... That's what we used to do in Ultima Online. That was one of the things we pioneered there, they had never heard of that before, and there were never any games with game codes like that before." (Markee Dragon)
Video linked below:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NXeZow0mE70
Years before Blizzard were able to deal with the gold selling crisis, those who sold gold were giving them the answer. The token. Blizzard was not the first company to use the token though, other games had success with adding tokens to their ingame environment as well. The token was the most obvious answer to a problem that Blizzard was never able to deal with until the token had hit the game. A problem that will persist without the token.
This new thread is pretty irritating given the work other posters had on the previous thread I created a few days ago.
Yeah that's true enough. It definitely disconnects the two topics which are pretty much on the same subject.
What I'll do is I'll merge the posts into the original topic. One sec. Merged now.
Sorry Selexin the poll will be lost. Also holy shit you're nearly level 60??
teebling Hmm disappointing that the poll couldn't remain, it's interesting to get a feeling of people's stance. A lot more people are willing to vote on a poll rather than put themselves out to be torn apart by someone extremely dedicated to the topic. A lot of the posts claim the community feels one way or another, the poll was providing actual data to back it up. Now the vocal members are the only ones represented, with the quiet or less confident members unwilling to weigh in to the heated and heavy debate.
Back to you Stfuppercut! The merging of threads has you looking like your talking to yourself at this point! :lol:
Back to you @Stfuppercut! The merging of threads has you looking like your talking to yourself at this point! :lol:
You tried to hijack the thread. It didnt go your way. Sorry man. You could always bring your opinion to the table so that we can discuss it? Perhaps you could use some figures and sources to build some credibility.